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MalinViktoria
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Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:05 am

Hi all,

I have a bit of a weird question... I'm hoping you ladies can tell me what you think of this situation.

So photographers usually get their clients to sign a contract, and in most contracts there is a Model Release clause, that states that the photographer can use the photos for promoting their business, i.e. website and Facebook page, etc.

Would you feel uncomfortable with this? Would you ever ask for the photographer NOT to use the photos for this purpose? In my opinion, it's a vital part of keeping a photography business alive, and if every client said they didn't want their photos used, the photographer would have nothing to show people to get more business. I'm unsure of what to do in this situation. On one hand, I probably have enough photos to promote my business anyway, but on the other hand, I can't help but feeling a little sad that I can't use the photos that I'll spend a lot of time and effort shooting and editing for my portfolio. :?

What's your opinion?

TIA. :)
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:53 am

Hmm I don't want to offend, but I think it's the client's right to not want their photos seen. It wouldn't phase me at all, but I can understand why some people may not want them published on the internet. Some people are very private and I don't think they should HAVE to have their photos used for advertising purposes, they are paying for the service after all. I can completely understand that you'd feel sad spending all that time taking beautiful photos and not being able to use them however if someone feels uncomfortable with it, then I can see why THEY'D be sad having their photos in public when they don't want them to be. Since they are the ones paying you, I think it's their right to say no? I hope that makes sense and doesn't sound rude!!
 
jaynage
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 11:28 am

It is 100% the right of the customer to refuse the photographer to use the photos in advertising etc. I don't think you can get around this.

I feel very strongly about this due to my profession. I work in the mental health industry, and there are certain types of photos and information about me that I wouldn't want in the public domain, out of concern that my clients may get hold of them. I was ok with my wedding photographer using our wedding photos, but if I ever did a boudoir shoot, pregnancy shoot etc., I wouldn't want those used outside of my own private use.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 11:35 am

^^^^ I agree with Jayne, wedding ones are no issue for me but I have a strong feeling about the boudiar shots, they are meant for a partner not to be put all over the internet I would not feel comfortable with that at all!
Saying that, you can always ask your clients to sign a model clause but tell them this is soley their choice, you will probably find 90% of your clients will allow you to use their photos as they feel special for being picked to be part of your advertising!
On another note though...isn't there also a clause where they can't used your images as advertising on their own. i.e entering competitions, or entering their images in a magazine. Perhaps if you wanted to imclude that as a condition on your model clause to say they have full rights to use their images as they wish you may get a better response!
 
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greensmonster
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:01 pm

yes, it's the clients right to refuse to sign that part of the contract but it's also your right to refuse to take on a client without that signature...

I am not bothered by the idea of my photographer using our images at all, but I can understand everyone's not like me!

I would suggest that if you cannot use the images perhaps there should be a surcharge.
 
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MalinViktoria
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:22 pm

Thanks everyone... I do understand that it's their right to say no, I just find it a bit strange just because I've done wedding photography for so long and no one has asked for this before. Just not sure how to handle it, but the surcharge idea sounds good.

I also agree with boudoir or pregnancy photos not being something that the whole world should see, but we're talking about wedding photos here; I wouldn't have any issue with not sharing other types of photos that would be specifically for their partner or whatever. It's just that generally, like Abbie said, people feel special if I end up using their photos on my website, etc.

And of course there is a clause where they can use their photos for stuff too; they can use them for whatever they like. The only thing in my contract that limits their use of the photos at all is sale of the photos for profit without the written consent of the photographer.

I really just wanted to know if anyone would have problems with their wedding photos being used by the photographer, and it looks like most people are fine with it. :)
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 3:06 pm

I would be 110% fine with my wedding photos used by the photographer.

Like Abbie said it's a huge compliment! :)
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 4:10 pm

I have to disagree with charging a surcharge just because they dont want you to use their photos for promotional use, how would you warrant a surcharge? Kind of hard to explain to prospective clients I would have thought, I'm trying to make money out of your photos after you've paid for the shoot?..They are paying you for a service not to fill your portfolio. In the end they are paying so they can have/use the photos not so you can If I couldn't have the choice of not having our shots used and facing a surcharge I would go elsewhere in my honest opinion - Im not trying to be harsh I just dont understand the problem, if your not comfortable with it let the prospective clients know. I honestly don't see the problem with a couple saying they're not comfortable with it :?
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 4:24 pm

I have some issues with my wedding photos being used because of the industry that I work in, like jaynage I have clients that I would not want seeing photos of me in certain situations.

Having said that, I'd be fine with my photographer using photos without my face, like the wedding dress hanging up, and my back while I'm facing the window, or even of FH and not me. But I'd have to seriously consider the other ones, and where they are going to be advertised etc. I think it'd be a compromise situation.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 4:35 pm

I agree with the majority of ladies here, whether we as photographers like it or not, our clients have a right to their privacy. They are paying us for a service, and if they don't want you using their wedding photos for advertising, then there's really nothing we can do but respect their decision. We have had a few clients ask us not to post their photos on Facebook etc, and we have always respected that. The more weddings you shoot, the bigger your portfolio will get.

I also strongly disagree with the idea of charging a surcharge - that would honestly make me go elsewhere. No one should have to pay to protect their privacy.
 
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MalinViktoria
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:59 pm

Summer_bride wrote:
I have to disagree with charging a surcharge just because they dont want you to use their photos for promotional use, how would you warrant a surcharge? Kind of hard to explain to prospective clients I would have thought, I'm trying to make money out of your photos after you've paid for the shoot?..They are paying you for a service not to fill your portfolio. In the end they are paying so they can have/use the photos not so you can If I couldn't have the choice of not having our shots used and facing a surcharge I would go elsewhere in my honest opinion - Im not trying to be harsh I just dont understand the problem, if your not comfortable with it let the prospective clients know. I honestly don't see the problem with a couple saying they're not comfortable with it :?


mrsctobe2011 wrote:
I agree with the majority of ladies here, whether we as photographers like it or not, our clients have a right to their privacy. They are paying us for a service, and if they don't want you using their wedding photos for advertising, then there's really nothing we can do but respect their decision. We have had a few clients ask us not to post their photos on Facebook etc, and we have always respected that. The more weddings you shoot, the bigger your portfolio will get.

I also strongly disagree with the idea of charging a surcharge - that would honestly make me go elsewhere. No one should have to pay to protect their privacy.


Well, the reason I'd be adding a surcharge would be because I would make special arrangements for them, I would have to change my contract to suit them, take out a whole section that is normally included in the contract, or possibly rewrite it to suit them specifically. :? And the surcharge wouldn't be huge, just $50 or so.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:05 pm

nah i dont mind, if the photographer thinks i look that good then go for it!! lol

but thats just me


we got some pictures taken about 2 - 2 1/2 years ago and they lady still uses a picture of my son.. i feel proud!
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:37 pm

But what do they get for the additional $50?? How are they benefiting other than protectiving their civil rights? I agree you shouldn't have to pay to protect your privacy! I can appreciate its a problem with contracts but not everyone wants their private moments used to further your career, personally it wouldn't worry me but I can certainly understand where others are coming from.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:42 pm

mrsctobe2011 wrote:
I also strongly disagree with the idea of charging a surcharge - that would honestly make me go elsewhere. No one should have to pay to protect their privacy.


I agree with this, I would be booking someone else if you asked me to pay to protect my privacy!

It also depends what you are planning to use the photos for. I would be fine if you wished to use my photos in an album that you show prospective clients and take to wedding expos. I would not be ok with my photos going on the internet. Perhaps you could have two clauses, one for physical use and one for digital use.

MalinViktoria wrote:
I just find it a bit strange just because I've done wedding photography for so long and no one has asked for this before.


If this is the first time it has happened then may be you could let this one go without changing business practice. If it became a popular request then maybe a surcharge would be warranted.
 
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MalinViktoria
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:01 pm

@ Summer_bride: They don't get anything as such, but it's paying for extra work that they are asking me to do for them, just like if I were to stay an hour extra to photograph their reception, or extra photos they wanted edited.

@ bronzestar: Because it is such a rare thing that occurs; I have a standard contract that I use, so if they want to change that, I don't see how it's wrong of me to charge for that extra bit of work. Ideally I would want a professional to look over it once it's changed as well to make sure all parties are protected, and this takes time, effort and possibly money if I have to hire someone to look over the contract before use. If it was something that occurred more often, I could make another contract that has a different clause, but this is basically me changing the contract for one couple, to accommodate their specific request.

I'm sure a lot of photographers (not just wedding photographers) are familiar with model releases; well, it's not something I can simply take out of the contract, it's a bit more complicated than that. So I would have to make a new contract for every couple who wanted something different, rewrite the model release clause for their individual requests (okay for albums, not for web, etc).

I'm not trying to argue that the clients are being unreasonable, not at all; I just have to make sure I cover myself for unexpected expenses like this as it's basically more work for less money and less use out of the photos. But again, I totally understand people who don't want their photos online, and I have no problem with that.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:08 pm

MalinViktoria wrote:
I'm sure a lot of photographers (not just wedding photographers) are familiar with model releases; well, it's not something I can simply take out of the contract, it's a bit more complicated than that. So I would have to make a new contract for every couple who wanted something different, rewrite the model release clause for their individual requests (okay for albums, not for web, etc).


Now that you have explained the reason behind the surcharge it makes a lot more sense! :D

However, even though i understand that it would cost u time and money, I would still be hesitant about booking someone who charges me extra for protecting my privacy. I'm not having a go at u about it... i'm just trying to explain what my reaction would be when choosing between photographers. Hope i explained that well - good luck with it all! :D
 
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MalinViktoria
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:14 pm

sugarb_91 wrote:
MalinViktoria wrote:
I'm sure a lot of photographers (not just wedding photographers) are familiar with model releases; well, it's not something I can simply take out of the contract, it's a bit more complicated than that. So I would have to make a new contract for every couple who wanted something different, rewrite the model release clause for their individual requests (okay for albums, not for web, etc).


Now that you have explained the reason behind the surcharge it makes a lot more sense! :D

However, even though i understand that it would cost u time and money, I would still be hesitant about booking someone who charges me extra for protecting my privacy. I'm not having a go at u about it... i'm just trying to explain what my reaction would be when choosing between photographers. Hope i explained that well - good luck with it all! :D


Thanks, I understand where you're coming from too. :D
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:20 pm

i can understand what the couple is asking. I had no problems with my photos being used but my husband was adamant that no image would be used without his
permission so it did limit photog choices for us as a lot of photogs would not consider changing their contract to accomodate. Mind you this was before he realised
i was splashing the photos all over the forum/facebook/etc anyway :) so his image ended up everywhere. In the end i even convinced him to let the photog use two of
our photos for her website :) i felt so previliege that she considered our photos good enough to put up.

In regards to the surcharge, I do not think it rude to ask, as a lot of extra work is involved for you to specifically produce a contract for them. And from my own
experience trying to find a photog who would remove the model clause, just finding one who is willing is near impossible and i would have been willing to pay if
it was neccessary to keep my fussy husband happy.
 
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Re: Photographer question - use of photos

Tue Jan 04, 2011 10:21 am

Malin - If you don't want to prepare a second contract then a contract is still binding if you cross out the sections about using the photographs and have each party to the contract initial it. However, I think it's more professional to have 2 proforma contracts - 1 for use of photos and 1 without and just print off whichever contract the customer is happy with. I wouldn't recommend that you amend each clause of the contract for each customer as that is time consuming and unnecessary and I think passing on a $50 fee is not a good look, especially when it's easy to set up a proforma contract before hand (just delete reference to use of photographs or put that the photographer can't use photographs without later written permission from the client)

I also think that if I signed a contract releasing my photos, I would still like the photographer to let me know out of courtesy if they were being used for advertising.
 
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Tue Jan 04, 2011 10:36 am

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